ten-oak-druid
May 4, 12:22 AM
They'll likely time it to match the release of the sprint iphone.
lordonuthin
Nov 2, 06:14 PM
We got them!
Well, we may pass each other back and forth a few times before we can really pull away...
Next target: 2.3 weeks away! Keep Folding!
And a little pat in the back as I just took the #8 spot on the team. Watch out this week #7! After it gets more tricky and WhiteRabbit is coming behind faaaaast...
was' up Doc! Yeah, looks like we will do musical chairs with Lithuania again maybe, he he, hope they are up to it :D
You know the story about the rabbit and the frog? Good, neither do I :p Oh, and pat on the back too.
That dang i7 is going back to normal units until I can figure out why it is so sloooooow... like a tortise...
Well, we may pass each other back and forth a few times before we can really pull away...
Next target: 2.3 weeks away! Keep Folding!
And a little pat in the back as I just took the #8 spot on the team. Watch out this week #7! After it gets more tricky and WhiteRabbit is coming behind faaaaast...
was' up Doc! Yeah, looks like we will do musical chairs with Lithuania again maybe, he he, hope they are up to it :D
You know the story about the rabbit and the frog? Good, neither do I :p Oh, and pat on the back too.
That dang i7 is going back to normal units until I can figure out why it is so sloooooow... like a tortise...
trader889
Jan 26, 11:18 PM
You can't tell much about where a company is going by looking at P/E, as by definition, this is a backwards-looking statistic. All of the companies you mention are growing far more slowly than Apple, which is why their trailing P/E ratios are lower. This is sort of what you said, but it's worth clarifying that you can't necessarily compare P/E ratios between companies with vastly different growth rates.
True, that's why I like to look at the PEG Ratio (P/E to Growth). If we take the current price of 130 minus cash net of payables and receivables (approx $17 a share), you get 113 for the "enterprise" value of Apple. I'll give it a conservative $5/share earnings this year, for a P/E of 23. According to Yahoo, we have an estimate of 30% growth this year, so we are getting a PEG of less than 1 for this year. Less than 1 is cheap, HOWEVER, it doesn't mean it can't/won't get cheaper.
I'm long Apple, so I have a bias, but here are some things to think about:
1) Market is reacting to bad numbers for the ipod, supposedly bad numbers for the iphone, recession concerns etc.. Do you think Apple is not going to come out with anything new this year that can add to the bottom line?
2) Apple is opening up more new stores worldwide. I believe their average sales at the stores is about $4000/sq foot. Their first China store is opening up in Beijing this year (think Olympics). Also, despite some of the headlines about no China iphone deal, CEO of China Mobile (370 million subscribers) stated this past weekend in Davos, Switzerland "We've not started any formal negotiations with Apple. The door is open to all for discussions about fashionable phones". This pretty reiterates what Steve Jobs said. Also, let's not forget all the other countries that have no iphone deals.
3) $18 billion in cash. Let's say that this earns 2%. Comes out to about 30,000,000 a month or .03 per share in earnings just on interest. On the conference call, I think one of the analysts said that Apple is averaging about $1 billion a quarter in cash, although last quarter was killer when they added $3 billion.
4) 45% of Apple's revenues come from overseas. This will only get larger as they open more stores overseas. Unless we get a worldwide recession, overseas sales should help cushion any US slowdown. Also, all the US analysts keep coming up with their updates based upon their "channel" checks, does this include overseas channel checks? I doubt it. So be wary of what they say.
5) Personally, I think the Macbook Air was developed with Japan in mind. In previous conference calls, CFO said Japan was one of the weaker markets. As some of you may know, Japan loves small, ultraportable computers.
Feel to comment/criticize, but as one poster said, if you think Apple is finished as a company, sell. If you think the future still looks good, don't look at the price of Apple for 3 months or as Warren Buffet says, 10 years..lol.
True, that's why I like to look at the PEG Ratio (P/E to Growth). If we take the current price of 130 minus cash net of payables and receivables (approx $17 a share), you get 113 for the "enterprise" value of Apple. I'll give it a conservative $5/share earnings this year, for a P/E of 23. According to Yahoo, we have an estimate of 30% growth this year, so we are getting a PEG of less than 1 for this year. Less than 1 is cheap, HOWEVER, it doesn't mean it can't/won't get cheaper.
I'm long Apple, so I have a bias, but here are some things to think about:
1) Market is reacting to bad numbers for the ipod, supposedly bad numbers for the iphone, recession concerns etc.. Do you think Apple is not going to come out with anything new this year that can add to the bottom line?
2) Apple is opening up more new stores worldwide. I believe their average sales at the stores is about $4000/sq foot. Their first China store is opening up in Beijing this year (think Olympics). Also, despite some of the headlines about no China iphone deal, CEO of China Mobile (370 million subscribers) stated this past weekend in Davos, Switzerland "We've not started any formal negotiations with Apple. The door is open to all for discussions about fashionable phones". This pretty reiterates what Steve Jobs said. Also, let's not forget all the other countries that have no iphone deals.
3) $18 billion in cash. Let's say that this earns 2%. Comes out to about 30,000,000 a month or .03 per share in earnings just on interest. On the conference call, I think one of the analysts said that Apple is averaging about $1 billion a quarter in cash, although last quarter was killer when they added $3 billion.
4) 45% of Apple's revenues come from overseas. This will only get larger as they open more stores overseas. Unless we get a worldwide recession, overseas sales should help cushion any US slowdown. Also, all the US analysts keep coming up with their updates based upon their "channel" checks, does this include overseas channel checks? I doubt it. So be wary of what they say.
5) Personally, I think the Macbook Air was developed with Japan in mind. In previous conference calls, CFO said Japan was one of the weaker markets. As some of you may know, Japan loves small, ultraportable computers.
Feel to comment/criticize, but as one poster said, if you think Apple is finished as a company, sell. If you think the future still looks good, don't look at the price of Apple for 3 months or as Warren Buffet says, 10 years..lol.
RavageScourge
Nov 16, 04:38 PM
I am getting an iPhone now YAY, along with a �30/mo contract but the phone costs �149 so the �149 is my christmas present... then i'll have a macbook (got that 2 months ago and loving it) and an iPhone two things i've wanted for ages
more...
Detektiv-Pinky
Oct 24, 09:25 AM
Wouldn't you know it, my Sister-in-Law's MBP just arrived Yesterday!
CD or C2D?
If CD I would return in immediately, preferably unopened...
Thats what I hate about this update policy. Yesterdays investment is losing suddenly 30% of its value. Apple should really address this by lowering prices before such an update...
CD or C2D?
If CD I would return in immediately, preferably unopened...
Thats what I hate about this update policy. Yesterdays investment is losing suddenly 30% of its value. Apple should really address this by lowering prices before such an update...
RawBert
Dec 29, 05:40 PM
When one starts approaching the weight of worlds fattest person they can no longer get to the toilet. So I feel sorry for the person with bed pan duty:eek::eek::eek:.
Oh God! *dry heave* You're right.
I'm sure fried chicken drumsticks sometimes get wedged in between her rolls for months at a time. Perhaps even whole chickens.
Oh God! *dry heave* You're right.
I'm sure fried chicken drumsticks sometimes get wedged in between her rolls for months at a time. Perhaps even whole chickens.
more...
oldwatery
Oct 18, 04:34 PM
Nice results especially as the street was forcasting around 50cents.
�Looking forward, 2007 is likely to be one of the most exciting new product years in Apple�s history.�
Oh yeh! I can't wait.:D
�Looking forward, 2007 is likely to be one of the most exciting new product years in Apple�s history.�
Oh yeh! I can't wait.:D
CorvusCamenarum
Apr 24, 10:25 AM
I just found that the person that was beat up was transgender and this was a hate crime. How come this is not all over the news? I guess hate crimes are okay now by black people but if a white person did this it would be the end of the world.
Black-on-white crime, much more prevalent than the reverse, is one of those open secrets the media doesn't like to report on, usually since they're too busy accusing whites of racism.
Black-on-white crime, much more prevalent than the reverse, is one of those open secrets the media doesn't like to report on, usually since they're too busy accusing whites of racism.
more...
blow45
Apr 28, 04:35 PM
1mm thicker, but the 30 or so people voting negatively are waaaaayyy thicker, and that rating system on the front page is colossally thick... and it's not enough that pretty much everyone hates that rating system, now we even have a rating system for posts... talk about anal retentiveness... :mad::apple:
YoNeX
Nov 3, 09:49 AM
Okay, they fixed the Portal, so I was able to download it, a 79.4MB file, lets see how this runs compared to parallels.
more...
roadbloc
Dec 30, 01:37 PM
I'm sorry, if you struggle to lose weight, you're not doing it right. Losing weight is dead easy.
Just like quitting smoking is dead easy for some people but really difficult for others? My gran after 50+ years of chain smoking just simply stopped. She says she had no problem, just didn't feel like spending to money anymore. I smoke about 5 cigs a day since the age of 13 and still struggling to quit.
Different people are all different. Some people find it very difficult to loose weight, whether that has something to do with a so-called 'fat gene' or just addictive personalities who are addicted to unhealthy foods, I have no idea. But what one person finds difficult, another person will have no problem with.
And the same with opinions on what is good/bad. It's easy to take mick out of people who are happy to be fat or are into fat people, but hey... whatever floats your boat. All they simply are is different. I like ginger/redhead women. dXTC likes his women large. Donna likes food. Everyone is different.
Just like quitting smoking is dead easy for some people but really difficult for others? My gran after 50+ years of chain smoking just simply stopped. She says she had no problem, just didn't feel like spending to money anymore. I smoke about 5 cigs a day since the age of 13 and still struggling to quit.
Different people are all different. Some people find it very difficult to loose weight, whether that has something to do with a so-called 'fat gene' or just addictive personalities who are addicted to unhealthy foods, I have no idea. But what one person finds difficult, another person will have no problem with.
And the same with opinions on what is good/bad. It's easy to take mick out of people who are happy to be fat or are into fat people, but hey... whatever floats your boat. All they simply are is different. I like ginger/redhead women. dXTC likes his women large. Donna likes food. Everyone is different.
res1233
Apr 29, 01:04 AM
You need a larger sample size though.
With only one data point for each, you need Poisson statistics. The standard deviation would be the square root of the value.
So the two values are:
138.8 +/- 11.8
141.2 +/- 11.9
So the error bars are large enough that we can't say for sure.
Also the difference is small enough that oils from touching them could be the difference.
Its good data though. Just need some more for better statistics.
Dude, you're thinking too much... There should be very little difference between two white iphones as well as two black iphones since they're made exactly the same. I'd say one test is fairly reliable in this case assuming those are the same scales.
With only one data point for each, you need Poisson statistics. The standard deviation would be the square root of the value.
So the two values are:
138.8 +/- 11.8
141.2 +/- 11.9
So the error bars are large enough that we can't say for sure.
Also the difference is small enough that oils from touching them could be the difference.
Its good data though. Just need some more for better statistics.
Dude, you're thinking too much... There should be very little difference between two white iphones as well as two black iphones since they're made exactly the same. I'd say one test is fairly reliable in this case assuming those are the same scales.
more...
iamthedudeman
May 3, 08:50 AM
Really good to see the update (finally)... but I am disappointed they didn't bring the 24" back :(
The 27" is too big, and the resolution on the 21.5 is laughable for an upgrade of this magnitude.
Still, quad core across the range is nice.
The biggest thing with the 27 is the yellow hue. Fonts. Glossy. And I like to change out my display and own the latest and greatest quite often, say every two years, or every year due to work at home.
Solution for me was I got a HP brightview 25.5. It is a MVA panel not quite as good viewing angles as the imac 27 IPS but with better black levels, deeper black levels, whiter whites, no yellow hue to speak of. Much better for graphical design work. Brightview technology has me hooked. All the benefits of a glossy and some of the benefits of a matte, less glare than the imac 27.
I have my 21.5 as a extra display and use the 25.5 as my main display in dual mode. Fantastic setup.
The 27" is too big, and the resolution on the 21.5 is laughable for an upgrade of this magnitude.
Still, quad core across the range is nice.
The biggest thing with the 27 is the yellow hue. Fonts. Glossy. And I like to change out my display and own the latest and greatest quite often, say every two years, or every year due to work at home.
Solution for me was I got a HP brightview 25.5. It is a MVA panel not quite as good viewing angles as the imac 27 IPS but with better black levels, deeper black levels, whiter whites, no yellow hue to speak of. Much better for graphical design work. Brightview technology has me hooked. All the benefits of a glossy and some of the benefits of a matte, less glare than the imac 27.
I have my 21.5 as a extra display and use the 25.5 as my main display in dual mode. Fantastic setup.
Krevnik
Apr 15, 04:27 PM
I like the new iCal :o
more...
will smith son trey.
(Will Smith#39;s Son Rapping?
more...
son Is+jaden+smith+dead
Can Will Smith and son get M.
Jaden Smith is the son of Will
more...
JeffLebowski41
Apr 13, 04:44 PM
Munster goes along with this huh? well, that's enough for me to discredit it. I wouldn't mind having his job. The qualifications are apparently nil.
ipader
Apr 13, 02:59 PM
How does one get to become an analyst? And what gives this guy any credibility? Seems like they just come up with crazy claims for the purpose of having something to say.
How can you tell when an analyst is lying?
His lips are moving.
How can you tell when an analyst is lying?
His lips are moving.
more...
Consultant
Apr 15, 01:22 PM
Any news in the latest build of Lion? When can I install it and be sure most works? :D
(on Snow Leopard)
1. Pay $99 to get into the Apple developer program.
2. Download and install in new partition.
(on Snow Leopard)
1. Pay $99 to get into the Apple developer program.
2. Download and install in new partition.
appleguy123
Apr 28, 11:48 AM
Is Intel in the pacific time zone, or have I missed a deadline change?
Burgess07
Apr 15, 03:14 PM
The "view" buttons in finder changed back to the old style.
281496
281496
tny
Jul 25, 08:17 AM
It's possible that the device has not yet been approved in other countries, and Apple rushed the release because it leaked yesterday.
More likely Apple leaked it on purpose to build excitement for the release. Anyway, my Mighty Hamster is on the way.
More likely Apple leaked it on purpose to build excitement for the release. Anyway, my Mighty Hamster is on the way.
displaced
Jul 30, 06:32 AM
Well go and tell that to Dell and their massive market share and we'll see if they take you seriously and change their marketing strategy. Theres ideology and then theres reality, I suggest you take a trip into reality. People may think Apple is innovative but so what? Most people buy whats cheap, not whats innovative, and since Dell isnt innovative in anything they do they can afford to be cheap. We have solid proof that innovation doesnt sell as well as affordability, what is there to argue about exactly? I think Apple is perfectly fine with having such a tiny market share especially since iPod is keeping them afloat (how many billions does Jobs need? Hes probably in no rush to make mroe money), but if Apple fans expect Apple to try and get more market share then they should expect them to lower their prices and offer things like Dell.
This is why I'm not too concerned about Apple getting Dell-like levels of marketshare.
I see value in both Apple's hardware and their software. In fact, I see more value in the software than the hardware. However, they make most of the money from the hardware, so in effect I'm helping the continued development of Apple's software with my hardware purchases.
If Apple sold machines for Dell prices, they'd only be able to afford to produce machines and software like Dell. Goodbye iWork, OS X, CoreVideo, xnu, Darwin, Quartz, Cocoa, Carbon, Xcode, Filemaker, Safari, iChat, Final Cut, Aperture, iMovie, iDVD, QuickTime, GarageBand, AppleScript, Compressor, Motion, Soundtrack, Logic, Shake, Xsan, WebObjects, ARD, iTunes... Most of these products existed pre-iPod. Heck, the money for iPod development probably initially came from Mac and software sales.
Some of Apple's business does intersect with Dell's, but I don't think it's fair to compare the companies as a whole directly. What's good for Dell isn't necessarily good for Apple. Dell's business is low-margin, high-volume and is specialised(*). They integrate components, and shift boxes. If what you need is a box of parts that'll run Windows, then Dell's a good place to buy. But for a sizeable number of people (over a million per quarter), Apple's a better fit.
A 'large' market share isn't ideal for Apple's business, simply because of the concessions required to reach it would kill the company. What's ideal is a sustainable market share. I think they've got the strategy right: keep developing products which are attractive, price them according to the balance between customer acceptance and fiscal needs, and (above all) simply be around to provide a good platform which is self-sustainable.
Most people may well buy cheap. But there's a market for Apple's products, and it's looking stable, with signs of measured growth. Sounds good to me.
(* - it may seem odd to call Dell's products specialised. But they are. Dell's basically a one-trick pony. Their business model allows little else. Consider how long it took them to consider AMD processors. The contemporary wisdom has been that the reason was twofold. Firstly, they were quite likely getting superb prices for Intel processors, and advertising money from Intel that may have been threatened by including AMD models. But also, it was noted that adding AMD machines would introduce an amount of complexity to Dell's supply chain management that could impact their margins. They had to wait until the potential market for AMD-based Dell machines was guaranteed to be large enough that it would offset the costs of diversifying. Dell has very limited flexibility. It has historically worked for them, but investors have been twitch recently over multiple profit warnings from the company)
This is why I'm not too concerned about Apple getting Dell-like levels of marketshare.
I see value in both Apple's hardware and their software. In fact, I see more value in the software than the hardware. However, they make most of the money from the hardware, so in effect I'm helping the continued development of Apple's software with my hardware purchases.
If Apple sold machines for Dell prices, they'd only be able to afford to produce machines and software like Dell. Goodbye iWork, OS X, CoreVideo, xnu, Darwin, Quartz, Cocoa, Carbon, Xcode, Filemaker, Safari, iChat, Final Cut, Aperture, iMovie, iDVD, QuickTime, GarageBand, AppleScript, Compressor, Motion, Soundtrack, Logic, Shake, Xsan, WebObjects, ARD, iTunes... Most of these products existed pre-iPod. Heck, the money for iPod development probably initially came from Mac and software sales.
Some of Apple's business does intersect with Dell's, but I don't think it's fair to compare the companies as a whole directly. What's good for Dell isn't necessarily good for Apple. Dell's business is low-margin, high-volume and is specialised(*). They integrate components, and shift boxes. If what you need is a box of parts that'll run Windows, then Dell's a good place to buy. But for a sizeable number of people (over a million per quarter), Apple's a better fit.
A 'large' market share isn't ideal for Apple's business, simply because of the concessions required to reach it would kill the company. What's ideal is a sustainable market share. I think they've got the strategy right: keep developing products which are attractive, price them according to the balance between customer acceptance and fiscal needs, and (above all) simply be around to provide a good platform which is self-sustainable.
Most people may well buy cheap. But there's a market for Apple's products, and it's looking stable, with signs of measured growth. Sounds good to me.
(* - it may seem odd to call Dell's products specialised. But they are. Dell's basically a one-trick pony. Their business model allows little else. Consider how long it took them to consider AMD processors. The contemporary wisdom has been that the reason was twofold. Firstly, they were quite likely getting superb prices for Intel processors, and advertising money from Intel that may have been threatened by including AMD models. But also, it was noted that adding AMD machines would introduce an amount of complexity to Dell's supply chain management that could impact their margins. They had to wait until the potential market for AMD-based Dell machines was guaranteed to be large enough that it would offset the costs of diversifying. Dell has very limited flexibility. It has historically worked for them, but investors have been twitch recently over multiple profit warnings from the company)
cwir
Apr 15, 12:24 AM
5 minutes on this forum and 2% battery goes to hell. Damn:(
bigjobby
May 3, 08:02 AM
It was possible to use the previous 27" as an external display for a MacBook. Can't see any mention of that after a brief scan, and it's a deal-breaker for me. Anyone spot such a feature?
Goldinboy17
May 1, 10:59 PM
I'm expecting Call of Duty: Mission Bin Laden
As long as it has Zombies I'm game. Killing Nazi zombies was getting old anyways.
As long as it has Zombies I'm game. Killing Nazi zombies was getting old anyways.
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